Fraudulent websites offering OpenOffice

[uritca]

I recently tried to download OpenOffice version 3 from a website that I thought was your website. The website was at the top of the Google search list (as a Sponsored link). The address is:

openoffice.3-suite.com

Having gone through the various steps which included foolishly giving my bank details I became suspicious and aborted my application. I have now discovered that my bank account has nevertheless been charged £25.86 by Mbcontact.com for nothing. Admittedly this is not a large sum but never the less it has been obtained fraudulently by an organisation pretending to be you and making a charge for doing nothing and apparently supported by Google.

Subsequently I was able to download Openoffice 3 successfully for your site at no cost at all for which many thanks.

I realise I will not be the only one to complain about this deception and fraud but I thought I would add my comments to the forum. I hope you will be able to prevent this bogus company from operating and encourage Google not to allow them to be presented at the top of their search list.

I have come across another similar site at: openoffice.org-2009.com

Regards,
Alistair

[Hagar Delest]

Yes, that's a known side effect of opensource:
- Fake Download Open Office 2009 - Credit Card Fraud
- Beware of fraud site that sells open office
- Misleading site - OpenOffice.org-Suite.com?
- openoffice.org-suite.com
- Paid for O.Office, but didn't download, how to download now?
- ...

[uritca]

Is there anything that can be done about it? Can any legal action be taken against these fraudulent sites?

Many thanks for your response.

[Hagar Delest]

No. They just can do it.

The problem is the lack of information of users using these sites. If you don't know what is OOo, you could believe that you've to pay to get it.

[Flaxthejute]

Having just tried a Google search, I find that the OP is right. The two sponsored links ARE from sites selling openoffice. BUT the first "real" result is unmistakably http://www.openoffice.org, with a list of clickable links (I've attached a screenshot).

I think that it it obvious which one I would choose

[uritca]

Why does Google allow websites to pay for a place at the top of the list when it is part of a fraudulent scam? Surely it must bring them into disrepute if they are seen as facilitating fraud. Don't they have a 'duty of care'?

[Caracalla]

Why does Google allow websites to pay for a place at the top of the list when it is part of a fraudulent scam? Surely it must bring them into disrepute if they are seen as facilitating fraud. Don't they have a 'duty of care'?

They're not really at the top of the list though. They're in a separate box for sponsored results. Now, if these sites were doing something illegal (rather than objectionable) it should be possible to make google strike them from their list of sponsored results. As it is though, i don't think there's much that could be done. What they are doing may be morally wrong but it's not fraud.
I guess OOo could try suing these sites for defamation of character?

[TerryE]

We've discussed this one a few times and Clayton has raised the issue with the OpenOffice.org management team, but I suspect that it turns out that Google are in breach of some EU legislation or whatever, I guess that they aren't going to turn away somewhat immoral but not illegal paying customers.

In terms of Alastair's original issue,

Having gone through the various steps which included foolishly giving my bank details I became suspicious and aborted my application. I have now discovered that my bank account has nevertheless been charged £25.86 by Mbcontact.com for nothing.

I believe that this is covered by UK consumer legislation. Can't you just contact your credit card supplier and explain the situation, that you entered your credit card details but aborted the transaction before confirming. I believe that they will just issue a credit against the supplier.

[ccornell]

The only thing we as users can do is bring this up to the OOo Community Council. http://council.openoffice.org/

OpenOffice.org is released under the GPL license, and this license allows people to resell OpenOffice.org provided they meet all requirements of the GPL (eg making source code available).

[acknak]

And all of these places that I've seen make it clear (in the fine print of course) that they are not selling the software. They're selling you access to their website and maybe other support. Whether that's worth anything or not, I don't know, but it's definitely misleading because the site looks like a software sales pitch.

The only steps that will have any immediate effect are:

• Be aware that Google promotes sponsored links. It's not hard at all to tell them apart from the real search results.
• Be aware that there are outright scams and frauds on the Internet: Protect Yourself. Doesn't everybody know that by now?

[Caracalla]

Be aware that there are outright scams and frauds on the Internet: Protect Yourself. Doesn't everybody know that by now?

Clearly they do not

[Hagar Delest]

Just for the record, the admin mailbox received 2 days ago a Nigerian scam (together with another one about winning 2 cars). If you don't see some of the moderators for a long time, it just means that we eventually got the money and have moved to the Bahamas.

[msooo]

This website and all of the others are 100% legit as I also own one.

I have found plenty of "real" posts on here to back this up and every site is under a special license. OpenOffice is a free software that under can be repkacaged and resold. If this werent the case people would be selling MicroSoft Office. Now obviously if you get a brain and look that isn't the case because you can't sell Microsoft Office becuase its licensed. I dont advertise on goodle because of all of the others but my site is no longer even advertised at all. However everytime anyone posts a thread on any if them IT BRINGS THEM SALES. Its called search engine optimization, so the best thing you can do is stop asking the same question as everytime you do your giving them backlinks.

"OpenOffice.org is released under the GPL license, and this license allows people to resell OpenOffice.org provided they meet all requirements of the GPL (eg making source code available)."

"This topic comes up all the time on the OOo mailing list too. OpenOffice.org is open source. People selling OpenOffice.org are not stealing it. It is legal to sell OpenOffice.org - check the license that OpenOffice.org is released under.

Many vendors repackage and sell OpenOffice.org on CD or DVD as a convenience service for people who cannot download the binaries (for example because of a slow connection). If you look here http://distribution.openoffice.org/cdrom/ you will see that there are loads of vendors selling OpenOffice.org on CD and/or DVD.

Sun for example repackages OpenOffice.org and sells it as StarOffice. There are several other companies that repackage OpenOffice.org and even include extras like templates, clipart etc plus commercial support for the price they charge end users."

"I wanted to make clear that it is not technically illegal to resell OpenOffice.org in whatever format as long as the terms of the license are being met. Those license terms do not say that people cannot sell a download link.

"There are a multitude of people providing a fair service of mailing out OOo CDs and DVDs on request for a small fee to cover time, and materials. It should be clear that reselling OOo is not an issue in itself."

[Caracalla]

Many vendors repackage and sell OpenOffice.org on CD or DVD as a convenience service for people who cannot download the binaries (for example because of a slow connection). If you look here http://distribution.openoffice.org/cdrom/ you will see that there are loads of vendors selling OpenOffice.org on CD and/or DVD.

Selling physical CD's is one thing, selling a download link to something that is available for free is immoral.

Sun for example repackages OpenOffice.org and sells it as StarOffice. There are several other companies that repackage OpenOffice.org and even include extras like templates, clipart etc plus commercial support for the price they charge end users."

Slight misunderstanding there. Staroffice predates OOo. OOo is, in effect, the open source version of Staroffice. Sun is offering something extra so i have no problem with them asking money for it. Most of these sites, though, offer nothing at all.

[msooo]

Exactly they dont offer anything extra. However I have made it my goal to offer many extras.

[uritca]

I would like to thank you all for your replies which are much appreciated. It is a lesson well understood. I won't do it again. In my defense I am an old duffer who is relatively inexperienced in matters of the world wide web. I had already reported the fraudulent transaction to my bank who are dealing with it. I am however convinced that it is fraudulent to take money without providing the service offered on the back of freely available soft ware. And that Google by facilitating the fraud are complicit unless they take steps to prevent such frauds. This would not be acceptable nor legal in a UK high street. I assume it would be seen as unfair trading in most countries. It brings those who knowingly facilitate the fraud into disrepute.

Father of Urtica

[uritca]

PS. I am pleased to report that my bank has refunded the payment.

[calmagmatt]

I too was scammed by these people having foolishly paid £17.91 for some kind of premium download and support for Open Office. I have had several email exchanges with them (they have a mailing address in Panama) but all to no avail. I am disputing the charge with my card provider as I write.