3.0 Mac font rendering

Issues installing under the Mac OSX - X11 - Aqua

3.0 Mac font rendering

Postby MarkBaldwin » Sun Jun 15, 2008 8:48 am

I'm using Mac OS X 10.5.3 and know that Mac os x and therefore native apps don't support free Unicode OpenType fonts adequately enough to display some complex script languages like Khmer. (for Khmer there is only one AAT font in each written script, it costs $49 and is ugly) I am using the X11 version of OO for mac because of this. I see the beta has only a "Native" mac version. since it is 10% of my monthly bandwidth limit here in Cambodia I don't want to download it if it won't work for me. Anyone know if it is using the standard mac font renderer that deliberately does not fully work with the OpenType fonts or is it using the UNIX one like the x11 version? Will there be a mac x11 version?

The following link has some gif images followed by the display of the font. This should look the same on non-mac systems that have enabled complex scripts (XP requires an update unicode dll) These languages have the same issues as khmer but, unfortunately, they don't have khmer listed. Still the problem is shown.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Multi ... ort_(Indic)#Check_for_existing_support
Amusingly, all the font's fail in Firefox because it doesn't support AAT fonts and OS X doesn't support OpenType. Safari displays some of them correctly because Apple has added fonts for a couple languages in this group.

here's khmer. no images to compare to though. I suppose I could send someone a writer file with an image and the corresponding text. it their willing to test the mac 3.0 version for me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khmer_scri ... ent_vowels

If you want to test it copy the khmer text from the above page and paste it into writer (provided you have a khmer font set up) On a mac using safari if it looks like in safari it ain't working.
OOo 2.4.X on Mac OSx Leopard + Micro$oft XP SP3
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Re: 3.0 Mac font rendering

Postby hdu » Wed Jun 25, 2008 2:56 pm

> Anyone know if it is using the standard mac font renderer

Yes, it uses the ATSUI font renderer

> that deliberately does not fully work with the OpenType fonts

On OSX 10.4 and OSX 10.5 they seem to work fine

> or is it using the UNIX one like the x11 version?

No

> Will there be a mac x11 version?

The X11 version will stay around for OSX 10.3 and earlier, but I'm quite sure that not much new development will be done on it. Anyway, thanks to OOo's open source code base as long as at least one competent developer interested in building it there will always be a X11 mac version.
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Re: 3.0 Mac font rendering

Postby MarkBaldwin » Thu Jul 03, 2008 8:00 am

>> Anyone know if it is using the standard mac font renderer
>
>Yes, it uses the ATSUI font renderer

The obsolete ATSUI renderer is worse than the new “Core Text” renderer at displaying complex text from OpenType fonts. They work with Apple's propriety AAT fonts (somewhat, ATSUI support is very limited). The best international support is from Vista, then XP, then UNIX (via Pongo?). Apple has only a few indic languages supported and that only with their fonts and for some only with “Core Text”. It is possible to buy 1 ugly khmer AAT font set (2 scripts) but documents made with it wont be interchangeable with pc and unix users.
>
>> that deliberately does not fully work with the OpenType fonts
>
>On OSX 10.4 and OSX 10.5 they seem to work fine

Well... I needed an office suite and MS-Office is severely lobotomized on the mac, iWork is too simplistic and not very compatible with the world, and the X11 OOo is not very friendly and has display issues so I downloaded the V3 Beta. I can assure you it doesn't display Khmer correctly or most of the other languages on the Wikipedia Indic language support page for that matter. (I copied the table and pasted it into OOo 3 beta and pages) If you don't read such languages the problem is hard to spot. Complex text layout languages put symbols before, after, around, above and / or below the preceding character. If you look closely you will see the symbols are either in the wrong order or overwrite each other rather than being joined in a specific way. The result is the text is garbled and is quite difficult to read. (I am only learning Khmer and not very fluent so it's virtually impossible for me to read and useless for printing documents for the locals.)

While Apple has chosen to invent it's own version of the wheel, claiming its “advanced” people who need to interoperate with others outside the Mac community will need to use X11 or Parallels with MS-Windows XP to do their international work. I had hoped OOo for the mac would help but I guess it can't use something like pongo without using X11.
OOo 2.4.X on Mac OSx Leopard + Micro$oft XP SP3
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